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Hudud or no hudud, Malaysia is NOT a Islamist country. This is clearly spelt out in the constitution. It is only the politicians who want to gain political mileage that raises the issue now and then. PAS must not play to the cunning tactics of UMNO by raising the hudud issue when they want the other parties of PR to support them. As long as hudud is not voiced in the KT campaign, PAS will get all the suppoort from its allies and the full force of PR will be there at KT to see that the dirty UMNO crooks will succumb to a repeat of March 08.

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PAS should listen to this Lion King becos when he speaks everyone listens.But lets go for our main aim,and that's to topple umno first.We must be united in our goal.With KT election fast approaching,we all must be determine to be victorious.Our enemy must be defeated at all cost.We must fight as one.Yes,we can!

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karpal, be rational in your time of approach. I know you mean well but as you could see Pakatan and PAS are in the middle of shaping up a solid fighting ground for this coming 17th Jan. battle. After the date, you could have all the discussion with PAS to your heart's content.

Right now, karpal, we need you to be there to lend a helping hand, the components of the coalition are supposed to help each other out when needs arises!

Hudud or no Hudud, it is entirely a different kind of issue that needs plenty of nut-cracking before all members come to agreement!!!

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Karpal,

You don't need to be an atavistic throwback who even responds to letters written by childish elements as you always do. I have great respect for you but when will you understand "political pronouncements" for God's sake? You No Hudud stand is political meant to get non-Muslim votes but Pas isn't telling to stop it. So why should you tell them to stop their Hudud stand to get their votes? Enough!

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The STAR has highlighted DAP's stand.

Now the focus shall shift to how STAR is going to highlight MCA's stand on Najis's statement on July 17 2007(http://www.bernama.com/bernama...?id=273699) that Malaysia is not a secular state but an Islamic State - Yes MCA we have had still been waiting for your stand since then.

STAR? MCA ? Are you all still there? Anybody home?

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Alamak, don't stir up more shit lah for PR when KT is near. Like RPK said, there is no way PAS can implement hudud as long as they do not sellout and betray Malaysia by cooperating with amno. Until then its all hot air by PAS and in any non BN democracy, anyone can say anything they like as in hello... Free Speech... (with exception of insulting races, the rulers and religions). So steadylah. peace.

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Pas (and DAP) have already made clear their stand on an islamic state and hudud laws and they don't have to keep repeating it everytime makes noise!

It is only for MCA to make clear their stand.

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One win in KT for PAS does not form the new government of Malaysia.

My advice to honorable Kapal, in fact to all PKR members, is to stop harping on the Hudud laws issue and instead concentrate and help PAS to win in KT.

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Dearest YB Karpal, now let us normal rakyat make it CLEAR to you.Dont take us normal rakyat as bodoh, we know & really understand that it is just not possible to implement hudud in Malaysia. Now as for you get back to work and DONT I repeat DONT ever ever ever bring this out anymore!

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PAS (as an Islamic Party) of course would want to introduce HUDUD law in line with its aspirations of setting up and Islamic country. There is nothing wrong with that, Karpal. If they weren't, they would end up as another hypocritical party like MCA and MIC which "pretends" to look out for the chinese and Indians....

The thing is it is up to DAP and PKR to maintain the balance of power so they cannot change that constitution.

Im begining to get worried over these PAKATAN leaders and their conservatism. I think they should really get RPK as their advisor and slap them around to make them see things more clearly.

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Folks, I'm sure this is roughly how the "interview" - if it really exists - went:

STAR: PAS seems to be fudging over the Islamic State issue. Don't you think Hadi should tell the whole world what his party really wants once and for all?
KARPAL (rubbing his beard): Well ... yeah, I suppose so. Frankly, I think PAS did make their intention clear a number of times ...

Star's version of the reply: “There should be a finality to the issue. He should do this for Pakatan’s sake,” he said.

STAR: Didn't DAP say in 1999 and last year (200 that it would cooperate with PAS only if that party would drop the hudud law?
KARPAL: I'm sure we did say something to that effect largely because 1) As a multicultural, multireligious society it's wrong for one side to impose its religious law upon the rest. Just as it was wrong of Dr.M to say Malaysia is already an Islamic state ....

Star's version of the reply: Karpal Singh said that DAP had set a precondition that PAS would not implement the hudud law before working with them in the 1999 and 2008 general elections.

STAR: Was this stance against hudud's implementation DAP's or merely your opinion?
KARPAL: Oh, many of us were against the implementation of hudud for the reasons I gave earlier, and also because it's merely rhetoric - PAS doesn't have the numbers to implement the laws. As such, why play to the gallery and announce to the world that PAS is going to implement the hudud laws? Won't it sound like Dr.M's Islamic State declaration or even AAB's Islamic Hadari concept? That's why DAP's firmly against PAS's statement on hudud implementation. Unlike MCA, DAP isn't going to be hypocritical.

Star's version of the reply: “Together with other DAP leaders, I have publicly given reasons for DAP’s firm stand against the implementation of hudud laws by PAS. Now the MCA has dared the DAP to state its stand on hudud laws,” he said yesterday.

Additional spins by STAR:
(Karpal Singh was commenting on a report yesterday when Terengganu MCA chairman Toh Chin Yaw called on DAP to clarify its stand on whether it opposed PAS’ stand to implement hudud laws if it came to power. Toh had added that DAP deputy chairman Dr Tan Seng Giaw’s presence during the announcement of the PAS candidate for the Kuala Terengganu by-election showed DAP’s compromise over its stand.)

STAR: But Husam Musa had made a statement that hudud laws would be introduced. Yet you're going to assist PAS in the coming by-election?
KARPAL: Well, we note that despite Dr.M's declaration of Malaysia state, MCA and other minor BN component parties not only didn't object, but even campaigned for UMNO in each and every election. So we've to see the large picture and help our Pakatan ally. Besides, Husam himself has already retracted his statement.

Star's version of the reply: Karpal Singh said that DAP only decided to assist PAS in the coming by-election after PAS vice-president Datuk Husam Musa retracted his statement that hudud laws would be introduced if Pakatan had formed the federal government last Sept 16.

STAR: Was Husam's announcement for hudud implementation support by the DAP and PKR?
KARPAL: What's the matter with you? We - DAP, and I think PKR as well - have time and again indicated that we would not support hudud implementation. Now I would like to see MCA ...

Star's version of the reply: “The statement was irresponsible and did not have the support of DAP or PKR. If there was no retraction, DAP would have to boycott the campaign. We are very clear on our stand.

Addition spins by STAR:
(“The attendance of Dr Tan during the candidate’s announcement cannot be interpreted as DAP’s compromise over its stand against the hudud laws,” he said. Karpal Singh said his party’s stand on hudud laws was clear even before PAS joined Pakatan Rakyat. He reiterated the DAP’s stand against any plan by PAS to implement hudud laws and has called on PAS’ president to openly state that they will not do so. Hudud laws, he said, were opposed even by the Muslims and were unconstitutional. Besides the constitution, he said a judicial pronouncement by the Supreme Court through a five-member bench in 1988 had stated that Malaysia is a secular state and not an Islamic state.)

And Star begins the whole trash with the lead-in statement: DAP chairman Karpal Singh wants PAS president Datuk Seri Abdul Hadi Awang to state “once and for all” an irrevocable stand against the setting up of an Islamic state.

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People, talking emotionally does not solve the problem!

To ask DAP to retract its stand is NO DEFFERENT from asking PAS to retract its stand! So stop saying it to appease one party over the other for exigency sake! If we want to solve this difficult problem, we have to think and be sensible enough to consider both the short-term and long-term implications as we help Pakatan Rakyat forward. Otherwise, it will be "short-term smart" and "long-term foolish". It don't have to be like that! Here are some suggestions:

1. We MUST FOCUS and support PAS to win KT irrespective of controversial views existing. It is too late a stage to resolve long-term issues before the election.

2. PAS neen NOT drop the hudud and and Islamic State concept. But they need to modify and repackage it to make it PLATABLE for the non-muslims and LEGAL in respect of the Federal Constitution. It should be noted that PAS DID modify their Islamic stance in the last election, so it is not as if they are so rigid they cannot be creative in solving the problem at hand.

On Point 2, this can be realistically achieved if what PAS declared is the real intention of their Islamic stand, i.e. Islamic laws are meant for muslims ONLY. The solution out of the delimma is, instead of taking the position that they form an Islamic State or to make Hudud law a federal law, they should consider aiming at forming a National Islamic Brotherhood where Hudud will be applied to Muslims (assuming the sufficient muslims agree to Hudud of course) within the "brotherhood". In this way, there is really no retraction of PAS's Islamic stand, and since Islamic laws are only meant for Muslims, the approach will not cross the boundary into the unacceptable sacred territory of infringing non-muslims rights or the Federal Constitution.

The people don't want UMNO-BN because they are rotten; but they also do not want to replace the rotten by losing their religious and other rights enshined in the Federal Constitution. PS may like to believe the Islamic State and Hudud laws are perfect, but that is a very arrogant position considering that is only PAS's worldview. It is not tested at best, and at worst are the horrific scenarios that we can see around the world with respect to Islam. Other than those who are blinded by their hatred of UMNO, the rest of the non-muslims will likely not agree. And does ALL muslims, including those who are non-partisan and those in UMNO (who are good muslims) agree? If they do, they would have joined PAS by now!

In conclusion, I urge PAS to BE PRACTICAL and BE CREATIVE in dealing with the issue!

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It is not a principle-centered or honest position to take by saying that PAS can never have enough votes to make the change and with that, their Islamic State and Hudud stands are Okay! The right position to take is to start by asking the question, "IS IT FAIR TO CHANGE THE FEDERAL CONSTITUTION IN FAVOUR OF A DOMINANT PARTY?" The question is one of "fairness" to ALL that is enshined in the constitution when Malaysia is formed. It is also about the seperation of religion and politics in the country administration. The problem facing the country negative "human excesses" that have gone out of control because of leaders' abuse of powers and corruption. It is highly unwise to take the position that we can solve the proble by replacing one form of excesses with "religious excesses". You don't handle curable cancer by dringking poison as the cure, especially when there are other better options, like surgery and chemotherapy. This may not be the best example, but we have seen plenty examples in our world how religion can poison a country and slowly move it towards extremism.

Pakatan Rakyat must take a moderate and sensible path before the BN does.

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Milo said it very well.

PAS need not use hudud laws as its battle cry, just like AMNO uses Ketuanan Melayu. The PR's pledge of good governance, fairness and justice should be used instead. It is acceptable by all who want change.

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What is Karpal Singh going to do if, say, 40 BN MP’s cross over to support Anwar Ibrahim as Prime Minister tomorrow? Is he going to withdraw his support for Anwar and choose to remain in the Opposition, that is, together with the members of BN who do not cross over? How many of the other 27 DAP MP’s will follow Karpal’s lead?
Assuming Pas wins KT by-election. Then, suppose 40 BN members cross over to support Anwar. With PKR’s 31 seats, and Pas’ 23 seats and 2 Independents (from Sabah), Anwar will have 96 seats altogether. Barisan will be left with 98 seats (including Ibrahim Ali, who will support Barisan, seeing that he will never support Anwar under any circumstances.) Will the DAP then throw its weight (28 seats) behind BN to allow BN to remain in Government? Or will the DAP allow its members to choose either to support Anwar or “to remain in the Opposition”. To form a new government Anwar would then need 16 DAP members to join him. Can Karpal prevent this 16 from “crossing over”? Let’s say he can, and Anwar managed to convince only 5 DAP members to cross to his side. We will then have three blocks in Parliament.98 Barisan (led presumably by Najib), 100 “Anwarists” and 23 DAP. So, at this point, who is Karpal Singh going to support as Prime Minister? Can somebody help me find the answer?

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Dear Karpal,
This is a democratic country. If PAS wants to enact Hudud laws, it has the rights to do so. Only they have to wait till they get a a majority to pass the law in parliament. That is not going to happen. Many Malays themselves will not agree to it. That is why PKR is still successful with the Malays. So please stop all this unnecessary uproar and fight for the common good of all Malaysians. If you want to go personal, go after Samy, very many Indians will be happy with you.

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dear saint....
allow me to correct you. you said "PKR is still successful with the malays". the reality is... UMNO got most malays votes. next to UMNO is PAS. PKR is not even in the equation. PKR seats won mainly based on chinese and indians votes. without these two ethnic minority support, PKR may only win permatang pauh. as for 70% malay majority seats, they were all traditional seats borrowed to PKR by PAS.

and for our great mr singh.... as if hadi would care about what you want! my foot!

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Kill UMNO la guys!! PAS must win in KT and we must be see to it.
My vote goes to PAS!!! Cheers!!

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harmanamri,

The questions you posed areno longer relevant. Karpal Singh did not take any such position that you have postulated.

Read Renoir /; LChuah posting above to understand what really transpired and how Karpal's words were twisted beyond recognition.

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maisur,

the issue is not just about current malay support as all support can change with time. The fall of UMNO on March 8 is a good testimony. The real issue is which party has values and a belief system that is most suited for a multi-culture Malaysia. If this is the standard we are measuring against, it has to be PRK. Although, DAP has similar values, they have too much baggages due to historical reasons which they have no control of. As for PAS, they are a long way off. They get many malay support because malays are muslims, but the chinese and indian support were as a result of the Pakatan Concept, and not otherwise. On its own, PAS will not draw much support from the non-muslims as they simply has little appeal. As for moral governance, any party could have taken that path, including those from BN. It is just that they failed to do so, and people has lost their patience, hence the result we are seeing in the election. I believe it would be a mistake if PAS are too arrogant just because of their current influence over the malay. Anything can change!

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Mr. Karpal,

Please pull the force of PR to win this by-election and sort out the internal dispute later.

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VOTE FOR UMNO....

COZ WE WILL DEFEND THE CHRISTIAN'S LAW AND LEGACY FOR THE BENEFIT OF ALL...

THERE WILL BE NO HUDUD LAW...

WE WILL BE LESS CORRUPT THAN PAS,

WE WILL THROW BILLIONS FOR OUR LOVELY RAKYATS,

WE WILL MAKE SURE THAT SEX PARTY, GAMBLING AND BOOZE CONTINOUSLY SERVE TO THE RAKYATS,

THERE WILL BE MORE SUBSIDY FOR RAKYATS....

OIL PRICE WILL BE GIVEN MORE SUBSIDY,

WE WILL GIVE THE IMMIGRANT CHINESE CITIZENTSHIP,

VOTE UMNO, MCA, MIC THE TRUE DEFENDER OF RAKYAT...

HUA.....HUA....HUA....

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My fellow Malaysians,

Anything that comes out from the SHITSTAR newspaper is only fit to be used to wipe the ass of your pet dog or cat. Just like the crap NST (New Shit Times), all lies and propaganda for UMNO and MCA. Don't ever believe anything you read from them

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Kapal, I respect you but please, stop attacking our friends, our brothers. Hudud or no hudud matters not compare to the what we could achieve together.

Pakatan must win, Pakatan WILL win.

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