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'The Assassination of George W Bush' and 'Politik Baru YB J' - REPLY PDF Print
Friday, 24 October 2008 20:57

A REPLY TO - 'The Assassination of George W Bush' and 'Politik Baru YB J' by Mansur Puteh

Mansur Puteh is misguided on the concept of freedom of speech. This pseudo intellectual’s selective application of rights and laws should be opposed by all concerned individuals.

agree with Mansur Puteh up to a point where the offending article is within the remit of freedom of speech. However I strongly disagree with the suggested application of this freedom by Mansur. I can say that Mansur Puteh is very confused on the concept of freedom of speech.

1.      Freedom of speech means you can say whatever you like no matter how offensive but it also gives the freedom for others to react to it in speech (not in violence).

2.      Freedom of speech is not absolute. There are laws which prohibit certain speech. For example encouraging people to riot is criminal in all countries depending on the context. Thus a joke song from Tenacious D to burn down City Hall is not criminal.

If people are offended, then they have a right to voice out. If these people do not like the newspaper at all, they can boycott all they want. This is very different than actually having a ban imposed by law. Any law will risk restricting freedom of speech because laws are not very flexible in application.

A defamatory article is also open to civil suit (not criminal) in court regardless of freedom of speech. If you say something defamatory then the person affected may seek redress. You either apologise or negotiate else be prepared to be sued. To be defamatory, the article does not even have to name the person. All it needs is to give enough reference for anyone to associate the character in the article with the real person.

By the way, we cannot compare the reaction of the leaders of the West to certain movies with the situation of Ms Kok, Mansur Puteh here has taken the movies out of context.

·         In Independence Day, even though the White House was blown up, the president and the American people are portrayed as heroes saving the world. The White House was also not blown up by a human thus it does not portray any individual or group of people as White House blowing people. There are no aliens on earth whom I know of who would get offended and sue the film makers. It would be madness for the White House to make any fuss over good publicity. At least they have brains to know a good thing when they see one.

·         In the Day of the Jackal, the victim i.e. the president, was not presented in a bad light thus it is not defamatory.

Make a movie where Ms Kok’s house explodes and she dies in the end because she defended all Malaysians regardless of race and the assassin is vilified as utterly evil; you won't find Ms Kok making much of a fuss. But publish an article where she is portrayed as insensitive towards one identifiable race and the assassination is seen as a natural consequence and wholly or partly justified then I'm not surprised at the rage. It’s not whether she dies, it’s what the article insinuates as to her character.

Where was I when the Danish cartoons blasphemed the prophet Muhammad? Well, that's freedom of speech. It's also freedom of speech for Muslims to protest. It is however not freedom of speech when violence is involved or threatened.

I still remember Menj making a remark of tattooing kafirs and never once I said that he should be banned as it is his right to freedom of speech. But it's also the right for others to ridicule him. Up to him to apologise, retract, etc. He is free to say what he likes; we are free to say what we think.

Some Muslims protest about allowing some stage performers from performing in public, I say that’s fine as it is their freedom of speech. But obstructing, suggesting/threatening violence and invading venues is not freedom of speech, that’s hooliganism.

Mansur Puteh, you are practising what the government is well known to practice in Malaysia, which is selective application of rights and laws. I can’t speak for others, but this really makes me want to puke. As much as you make me want to puke, I won’t stop you from making more disgusting statements.

Mansur Puteh, you should perhaps spend more time abroad as you suggested, to learn more about freedom of speech. But if you are already abroad then I suggest you get out of your safe zone and pay much more attention. Who cares about what Hollywood and American literati has done when there is enough to confuse Malaysians with local examples. The evil is not USA or the West but just outside your front door!

 - AsamLaksa

Some say it stinks and it’s made of rotten fish. Some say it’s too spicy or sour. Whatever it is, it is what it is.

Comments (15)Add Comment
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written by ahmadneil, October 24, 2008 20:59:20
Breaking news...
My source in Mongolia have just call me to inform me that I can leave at anytime I chose.So from now if You don't hear from me,then I'm secretly making my way to Mongolia.Guys if you have any question that you want me to poise to Shaariibuu Setev,kindly post it in MT and I will record it down.Try to make your questions short and clear,straight to the point,becos I will be engaging a translator.Thanks.
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written by indianputra, October 24, 2008 21:02:19
DEEPAVALI 2008 is cancelled throughout Malaysia. No Indian or Hindu will celebrate Deepavali this year in Malaysia until the HINDRAF 5 and RPK is released from ISA. Indians irrespective of the political affliations have no right to celebrate the Deepavali when innocent Hindus and martyrs are suffering under ISA in Kamunting.

If any MIC/PPP/IPF leader or branch holds any Deepavali open house, all Indians and Hindus must boycott the open house.

All Indian Pakatan Rakyat MP's and State Assembly men must NOT hold any Deepavali Open House.

Indians, please UNITE for the sake of unjustified detention of our Hindu brothers in Kamunting. Please spread the news!
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written by asiseesit, October 24, 2008 21:40:07
we can't even compare ourselves to the west simply on the basis that our government deemed it's people immature to handle the real picture. while they armed themselves with all the knowledges from the west, it kind of gave them the right for media filtering. and i'm not saying censorship here. how they deliver the facts to the public, making it grandeur in their actions, it's like a marketeer promoting a product to a potential customer. the only different is, this buyer (public) cannot, and are not, allowed to question or clarify it before buying into it.

i was at the forum. from the first speaker (teresa) till the last speaker (LKS), it gave me a grave sense of reality i have to accept. while one cannot ignore that the cerpen in some way bears too much similarities to the actual event, it can also create a trend for others to jump on the bandwagon and start creating fictitious stories to counteract succeeding cerpens.

it had already started anyway in two of the blogs.

i don't call that freedom of speech. it's more like freedom to incite hatred in intellectual form. like what Wan Hamidi said in the forum, the pen has the power to kill.
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written by krising1, October 24, 2008 22:03:06
Mansor White, you claim that you are a graduate an in ivy league American university. I have a very simple question. Are newspapers all over the world not sued for libel or defamation? It even happens in the mother of democracies - UK and USA. Are you saying that there is no freedom of press in these countries? The papers can write what they want but they have to answer for what they say. Any aggrieved person can take a newspaper to court and seek relief and damages. It is an independent court which will decide whether the person has been libeled. No one goes to jail or is detained under arbitrary laws. That is press freedom. Both sides defend their positions and a neutral person makes a decision. The decision is not final as there is an appeal to a higher court. Being sued is part of a newspaper's recognised occupational hazard. I am sure with your ivy league education this explanation is simple enough to understand.! Any way what is your stand about Malaysiakini's "Najib manifesto"
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written by kennyeu, October 25, 2008 00:15:53
AsamLaksa, well done. Too bad not everyone understands reason and some are just unreasonable. Thanks for at least trying to bring back some semblance of sanity and humanity to a place full of inflated and self serving egos.
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written by MalaysiaBaru, October 25, 2008 01:15:23
ahmadneil

I don't know whether you are pulling our legs or u r indeed one of the PKR intelligence agent. Assuming u r the latter...Please tell Dr Shaariibuu Setev not to waste time waiting for the Korek,Korek,Korek court in Malaysia to reveal the truth and deliver justice. By now, I m sure Dr Shaariibuu can judge for himself how credible our justice system is.
Ask him to seek the help from the Mongolian government to bring the case up to the International Court of Justice, or at the very least ask the Mongolian government to request for the Interpol to be involved in the investigation. However, before doing that, please get the Mongolian people informed by publishing all the trials and circumstantial evidences that point towards the SHIT who ordered her cruel murder. Because when the Mongolian people are so angry with Altantuya's murder and obstruction of justice by SHIT, their government will have no choice but to take action even if evil Shit tries to bribe the Mongolian government officials to close one eye.
We have to bring this matter up to Interpol. There is no two way about it!
Finally, many thanks for your tireless efforts to keep the flame alive and bring about a better Malaysia.

By the way, anyone who knows the passport number and birthdate of Mr SHIT and Altantuya, please post it here. It is needed to free our beloved RPK.
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written by renoir, October 25, 2008 05:19:34
I wonder why Mansor would use American examples without comparing their contexts. Those who're familiar with American First Amendment cases - I'm not an expert though I'd read a few such cases - would know that the infamous WW1 Espionage Act still exists today, though with some amendments and perhaps seen under a different light. When, during WW1, Supreme Court Judge Oliver Wendell Holmes convicted Charles Schenck under this law, he used the shouting "fire!" in a theater analogy, saying that Schenck's distribution of anti-war leaflets would cause panic and thus create a "clear and present danger" to life and liberty.

As Howard Zinn pointed out, the above analogy simply did not fit: Schenck's action was more like "someone getting up between the acts at a theater and declaring that there were not enough fire exits."

But the "clear and present danger" stipulation certainly applies to Teresa's case. She was not only ISAed on groundless charges, but also had molotov cocktails thrown into her home, not to mention a coarse, menacing note as well. What more evidence do we need to show that her life WOULD be threatened by assassination stories of women MPs, the type published by Utusan Melayu?

Decades ago Arthur C. Clarke compared a 60s' baccalaureate with a high school diploma: today a Master is little better than a basic degree, and a Phd no more than a Master's. So young graduates with whatever paper qualifications should wise up and spend more time educating themselves than write brainless articles that only reveal their ignorance or lack of intelligence - or both.

LChuah
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written by joseph81, October 25, 2008 10:34:24
What freedom of speech ? We have ISA, OSA , seditious law etc, if we practise freedom of speech it's just for show
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written by Jit Dharma, October 25, 2008 15:21:39
Mansor Putih, save the crap talk for those that give a shit about the sheer
stupidity of your 'argument' for free speech.What you are doing is defending the indefensible. Throwing an innocent women in prison on trumped up political charges, is an act worthy of the Gestapo. Celebrating her fictional assasination as an act of free speech is pure Facism.Too bad you are either too stupid or too much of toadie to see this.
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written by Taufique, October 25, 2008 17:01:32
Mansur Puteh and Rocky can go dive into Alam Flora's septic tanks and enjoy themselves.
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written by Taufique, October 25, 2008 17:02:44
or was that Indah Water....my bad. either ways. yeah, garbage in, garbage out.
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written by AsamLaksa, October 25, 2008 19:07:55
There is more than it meets the eye. My target is not wholly Mansur Puteh. It's also others who apply rights and law selectively which comes from both sides of the arguments.

Densemy, there is a fine balance between freedom of speech and social responsibility. Freedom of speech which veers into social irresponsibility is not on. What What then is the standard of social responsibility? That depends on the context. No law can define it. Laws such as Race Relations Act that tries to limit freedom of speech while trying to impose certain standard of social responsibilities are only useful in specific context and has many problems. I cannot tell you where to draw the line.

For example, if you make a racial slur in a meeting full of like minded people, what you say may be wrong but there is no one around to get offended by it. But if you fail to make sure that there is no one who would be offended by it, you risk trouble. Thus it's not so much what is said, but to whom it was said. Take the Ahmad Said incident. If he simply said it within a closed meeting of like minded UMNO members, he would have gotten away with it as there would be no one offended to complain about it. But he said it during open campaigning. He practised his freedom of speech but in a socially irresponsible manner. Same like some guy calling a royal an animal - freedom of speech but socially irresponsible.

I had a long argument/discussion with a German friend about social responsibilities with examples of Neo-Nazi groups.

Freedom of speech is not a total defence. Thus any publication including MT should not be 100% immune just because it shouts freedom of speech. Freedom of speech is a right which should not be abused.

Should social responsibility trump freedom of speech all the time? This is something which academics may find interesting to argue about. For me, freedom of speech should try to push the boundaries all the time to push society to maturity. It is with this struggle between the two that will shape and define society in years to come. I wish for the day when nothing is taboo and all differences be discussed in a rational manner.

Thus, teach freedom of speech. Tell everyone to value it and don't abuse it. Teach them also about social responsibility and love everyone.



P.S. Universal love is not very difficult, all you need to do is beat yourself up until you accept it. smilies/cheesy.gif
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written by educationist, October 25, 2008 19:23:49
A very precise and accurate reply!
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